Do Bananas live long, or well, at 33-50F ?
I was thinking of planting some basjoos in pots and just moving them into the garage for the winter (which is subterranean and stays at around 45), or perhaps thinking of some clever invention where I'd dig a whole next to the banana, and whenever there's frost coming, I could pull a lever and drop it into the hole where it's always 50F. If I had the means, I might consider orchard heaters too. Anyway, would the banana still look good at those lower temps?
The following thread was started by Sven, Astoria, OR on February 06, 2010 at 6:44 pm PST
They do just fine until
FROST!
Musa basjoo and other cold hardy bananas do just fine until it freezes... if you have small plants you might wanna put a tent over them...
The above followup was added by Kenton on February 06, 2010 at 7:20 pm PST.
That's good to know... but I guess as a final test I should ask someone in Eureka, CA or Brookings, OR (frost free places that don't usually get above 55F)... if they look decent there over several years, out of the wind of course, I might just start thinking about this subterranean latch invention of mine...
The above followup was added by Sven, Astoria, OR on February 06, 2010 at 7:35 pm PST.
generally look tattered in the winters here along the north coast, and of course a zone 10a does get frost....so nana leaves do get fried here. But the cold duration is very short, my ensete is pushing out new fronds currently. I wouldn't recommend planting musa or ensete unless you've got a protected location in the immediate coastal areas, just a mile east of here some large musa can be found.
The above followup was added by Matt-Eureka CA on February 06, 2010 at 7:40 pm PST.
Thanks Matt, is the tattering just due to wind or is it the result of the frond getting weak and limp from the cold or something? Yes I realize you still get frost there, I just thought the otherwise long and mild winter would give a good gauge of how the banana would hold up.
So does the banana liven up again in the summer, or is it perpetually kind of scruffy throughout the year?
The above followup was added by Sven, Astoria, OR on February 06, 2010 at 7:52 pm PST.
I know of a big one on 4th St. in the Whiteaker neighborhood, but the backdrop in this photo doesn't look quite right. I'd love to learn about another huge banana in the Eug-Spr area.
The above followup was added by Eric, Springfield on February 07, 2010 at 1:19 am PST.
Depends on Species I live in Florence .
Join the Banana.org list its got tons of info .
Yeah more Oregonians with bananas
i have 5 cold hardy species. good luck Westwood on banana.org
The above followup was added by Tammy on February 07, 2010 at 2:51 am PST.
Bananas look bad during winter on the Cal coast due to lack of heat, not usually freezing temps. the leaves are just not meant to live that long, and if a replacement does not come soon enough, the color and firmness of the leaf suffers and makes the plant look anemic. Same thing happens in Down Town San Francisco. I remember a restaraunt there that put a plastic tarp over a planting that was a seating area in summer. They still looked sickly.
The above followup was added by Brian in Bremerton on February 07, 2010 at 7:28 am PST.
Brian, that description of the banana in san francisco is what I was worried about- just a general anemic appearance because of the lack of heat.
Eric, that pic of the banana in the snow is just a random photo I found, the actual one I see in Eugene is up on Cresta de Ruta street at the summit of Hendrick's Park. I know about that one on 4th too, which is bigger.
The above followup was added by Sven, Astoria, OR on February 07, 2010 at 12:38 am PST.
Which has a similar climate to coastal Oregon and west coast Washington. We are talking Musa basjoo, right? This is in Botanical gardens:
The above followup was added by Vlad Pomajzl, Saltspring on February 07, 2010 at 1:54 pm PST.
Sorry for the mistake. Botanical Garden:
The above followup was added by Vlad Pomajzl, Saltspring on February 07, 2010 at 1:55 pm PST.
This is Brian's garden in Tofino. I was not particularly interested in his bananas when I took this pic but he has plenty and you can see them in the background:
The above followup was added by Vlad Pomajzl, Saltspring on February 07, 2010 at 1:57 pm PST.
Here is one more from the Tofino's Botanical Gardens. It is not very far from Brian's place. Lots of rain here and cool summer temps:
The above followup was added by Vlad Pomajzl, Saltspring on February 07, 2010 at 2:00 pm PST.
Thanks for the pics Vlad. Those are summer pics though right? I was more curious just to know how bananas do in winter months when it's cold but doesn't quite hit freezing... i.e. do they retain a good appearance or do they become anemic-looking as Brian described.
The above followup was added by Sven, Astoria, OR on February 07, 2010 at 2:06 pm PST.
Sven, those pics were taken in October. I will see if I can get hold of Brian. I was actually more interested in the fate of those desert subtropicals he's had in his garden for several years now. But Tofino does get frost so I imagine those bananas don't look that great right now.
The above followup was added by Vlad Pomajzl, Saltspring on February 07, 2010 at 3:10 pm PST.
Many of the stalwarts of zone 8 exotic gardening do worse, not better, in zone 9 areas of the coast (this is another problem with the USDA Zone, as the coast is overall a much cooler climate). Trachycarpus fortunei, Musa basjoo, cannas, and numerous other "Zone 8 plants" required some seasonal definition, and above all, a distinct summer.
Along the coast, different species of exotics do better in the summerless conditions that prevail here. Nikaus and CIDP's do better than trachies and chamaerops, ensetes do better than musas, and Tacsonia section passifloras do better than the really cold-hardy types like P. coerulea. Fruit growing is even more challenging.
Finding a wind-protected area on the coast is nearly impossible in many areas. A lot of ensetes are grown in containers on back porches where there is a wrap-around created by building bump-outs.
The above followup was added by Steve in Brookings on February 07, 2010 at 3:35 pm PST.
I am in the sant Cruz mountains and my bananas have ripened fruit in March after many days not reaching 60F.
The issue is that bananas will start to yellow at about 35F and it gets worse until about 33F, at which point they start to burn. There are two things you can do to keep them nice: one is overhead canopy, that will leave them looking healthy down to about 32F, the other is to heat them with an orchard heater when the temperature drops below 35F.
One thing is for certain: they look fantastic even if temps remain around 35-55F except if you get heavy winds, then they will look shredded.
Most winters my bananas look great, ensete ventricosum will even put on new leaves when temps are below 60F.
This Winter, the Sprinklers went on the only night we dropped to 32F, so they turned brown for the first time. I have them all over the garden because they look so tropical.
The above followup was added by Axel on February 07, 2010 at 4:53 pm PST.
I believe most of your efforts you would go to in order to keep your bananas green during winter are to difficult unless you wish to container grow them which will drastically limit their size. The normal winter storms with high winds will ultimately make them look terrible in the winter even if you got lucky enough to have a frost free winter. I am originally from the Portland area and grew bannas there with plenty of success. The loss of foliage at some point duroing the winter is inevitable but plenty of times there were green bananas at christmas time. I find that Musa Basjoo does just fine with temps between 33F and 55F. They won't grow but they will continue to look great unless the wind tears them up. Most winters in Astoria it probably doesn't get cold enough to kill the trunks of Musa Basjoo so come spring your bananas would put up new shoots right from the top of the trunk. I used to wrap my trunks with bubble wrap during the winters in oregon and that seemed to preserve the banana trunks through the winter as long as temps didnt' dip below the low 20s. I would encourage you to give them a shot in Astoria. They should do just fine there.
The above followup was added by Eric, San Jose, CA on February 08, 2010 at 8:17 am PST.
Thanks for the info Eric, I'm glad to hear another vote for the 'looks good besides wind damage' side of the camp. I'd have to look into the costs of orchard heaters, but I wonder if it wouldn't be worth it to heat bananas on the cold nights- because in reality, if I have an empty lot or yard that needs expensive landscaping anyway, apparently musa basjoo can get huge in just a couple years of growth... and maybe the cost of heating them would be less or equal to the cost of bringing in some large landscaping focal points. Who knows, maybe if I get a banana plantation or something, people will wanna host their events in there and I can make up the costs with that ;)
The above followup was added by Sven on February 08, 2010 at 6:06 pm PST.
Most of my experience with bananas that look good through the winter involves Ensete ventricosum v. maurellii and Musella lasiocarpa, which both can look very good all through a winter here in the San Francisco Bay Area, even when temps get down into the mid 30'sF. Neither of these two yellows in cool weather, and can look great if protected from strong winds. The growth on both these definitely slows down in winter, so if the foliage does get trashed by a storm or frost, they won't really push significant replacement foliage until it warms up again in March.
For your purposes, it would seem to make a lot more sense to plant a cold hardier species such as Musa basjoo in the most wind/frost protected spot you can manage, and trim off damaged foliage when/if it occurs. I'd suggest it makes more sense to accept the cold/wind damage in winter, and trim to remove. If you protect the trunk from futher cold/rain induced rot, you will have a much larger/taller plant the following spring once it warms up again. Bananas are so fast growing once it does warm up,(as long as they get all the water they want), that it seems rather pointless to spend so much time trying to keep pristine winter foliage in your climate.
If you were growing a banana look alike such as Heliconia scheideana or Strelitzia nicholai, which are slower to grow and return to full form after a freeze; I would recommend extra efforts to keep them from winter harm. With Musa and Ensete and Musella, they bounce back so quickly, why bother. It is always the extra strong winds associated with winter storms that end up ripping up the foliage here in winter. Only the Ensete ventricosum in the most wind protected locations come through the winter looking as good as in summer. I have one E. ventricosum planted in an 8 foot wide side yard between two 3 story houses that is probably 30 feet tall now, and the trunk is over 2 feet in diamter; it looks flawless still because it is so wind sheltered.
The above followup was added by bahia on February 09, 2010 at 11:18 am PST.